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Author Topic: Decision 2016  (Read 2568 times)

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Offline stevethetree

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #40 on: November 10, 2016, 10:46:14 PM »
I just can't believe the government of the nation that uses the most resources is going to be completely run by a party that still denies climate change. I guess some Republican senators can choose to accept it sometimes, but that isn't really going to do much.

I guess if the human race goes extinct you'll get rid of all the religious people you don't like.

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #41 on: November 11, 2016, 12:36:44 AM »
So why do the biggest pollution producers China, India, Mexico get a free pass but the US has to sign over its sovereignty to the UN to fight so called climate change (the weather) but you can't tell me the carbon credit scam that Gore set up is really going to do anything by swapping credits back and forth, in the early 1900's they thought there was going to be a global freezing so I don't think they know much of anything with the cooking of the books and data manipulation, it's just another global world order scam for more control
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline stevethetree

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #42 on: November 11, 2016, 05:36:09 AM »
So why do the biggest pollution producers China, India, Mexico get a free pass but the US has to sign over its sovereignty to the UN to fight so called climate change (the weather) but you can't tell me the carbon credit scam that Gore set up is really going to do anything by swapping credits back and forth, in the early 1900's they thought there was going to be a global freezing so I don't think they know much of anything with the cooking of the books and data manipulation, it's just another global world order scam for more control

The UN views China and the US as problems 1a and 1b. It's frustrating if nobody else plays by the rules, but we can't just piss in the pool because everyone else is doing it. And yeah, letting people buy their way out of reducing emissions doesn't solve anything, especially when the prices plummet so quickly. At least he tried something. I've never heard about climate scientists in the early 1900's (Marston's time?!) but I know the global cooling craze of the 70's was mostly due to scientists in a new field not quite knowing all the details, with a little bit of "small sample size" thrown in. Even in the 70's climate scientists were predicting global warming. Have you heard that 2016 has had record setting monthly temperatures? It would be great if this was all some hilarious coincidence but I can't deny all the years of connected evidence researchers have found. I'm sure if some scientist had clearly disproved it they'd be getting loads of national attention, and an even bigger load of money.

I'd be fine with being proven wrong about it. I'd rather be humiliated than worried about the future of humanity. All this talk probably sounds overdramatic, but I feel like it's not getting the attention it deserves.

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #43 on: November 11, 2016, 09:48:56 AM »
I agree there can't be some umpteen billion of us and not have an effect on the planet but when there is proof that nasa fucked with the numbers to fit the model you just can't start screaming the sky is falling when everyone can look outside and see we had a mild summer and call everyone criminals and stupid cause they don't agree after seeing your predictions not come true and then they lie about the results
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #44 on: November 11, 2016, 09:55:27 AM »
Oh and the UN is a joke and they should just blow away
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #45 on: November 11, 2016, 10:43:16 AM »
I agree there can't be some umpteen billion of us and not have an effect on the planet but when there is proof that nasa fucked with the numbers to fit the model you just can't start screaming the sky is falling when everyone can look outside and see we had a mild summer and call everyone criminals and stupid cause they don't agree after seeing your predictions not come true and then they lie about the results

How do you explain the melting ice caps? It's global warming, not America warming.

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #46 on: November 11, 2016, 11:27:37 AM »
I guess that every time they went to measure the ice they kept getting stuck in the ice hundreds of miles from this point they were trying to reach means there was a lack of ice? Read about the cooling of the great lakes in recent history, You know the hundred plus years of info we have is a nanosecond in the time life of our planet so how can we really make an informed conclusion of our affects on the planet, my thoughts or that we are the cockroaches of the universe and that a more advanced life form well come and spray us with Raid everywhere they can find us throughout the universe  (whip)
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline stevethetree

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #47 on: November 11, 2016, 10:17:40 PM »
I didn't know that about the great lakes, that's pretty interesting. Maybe that's why the nearby states voted red this year.  ;)

Climate change doesn't necessarily mean warming everywhere. Some places will have more extreme weather, which looks like what could be happening there to me. And there are estimates of prehistoric temperatures from fossil records, but that probably isn't very convincing since you keep bringing up fabricated data.

NASA did fuck with the numbers, but the numbers were fucked up to begin with. Back then, temperatures weren't taken throughout the night, so the minimum temperature was usually at sunrise (higher than it should be). People just weren't recording the weather as seriously as they do now. So scientists came up with a formula that made adjustments to the older temperatures based on a bunch of factors like that. That formula even increased some temperatures. When they compared the results to independent data, it wasn't even that different. It was actually a little higher. So unless it's some international conspiracy going back one hundred years, I don't think there was any sort of political adjustment. It's just science trying to do the best it can under shitty circumstances.

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #48 on: November 12, 2016, 10:39:48 AM »
That just goes to show we don't know
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #49 on: November 13, 2016, 01:34:16 PM »
The Great Lakes have been getting warmer over time. That graph you posted is ice cover, as this shows it has been decreasing over time.

« Last Edit: November 13, 2016, 01:39:18 PM by Cheese »

Offline convex airplane

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #50 on: November 13, 2016, 04:12:48 PM »
Islam, much like most other religions, is a dangerous doctrine that preaches oppression. Of course I do not - and would never - support the genocide of over a billion people, but I also refuse to make excuses for the practices of this religion (which the mainstream Left seem more than happy to do these days).
After living in Germany for a year, I have seen enough of the so-called "moderate" muslims to feel the need to publicly speak out against these practices. Watching women being treated like second class citizens (wearing full body suits, walking 5 feet behind their husbands, not allowed to go out alone, etc.) is unbelievable. People who claim to be "Progressive" while defending such practices are just hypocritical. Why should we allow (& even support) immoral and inhumane behaviour just because it is labeled a religion?

I think taking in refugees was undoubtably the correct thing to do, but we need to be aware of the fact that the vast majority of the refugees hold values that are fundamentally different and incompatible (yes, incompatible) with our values. That is where we on the Left went wrong, we censored (through public name calling and shaming) anyone who criticised the religion. I did it too when the refugee crisis began. The only people to blame for Trump are ourselves.


All that being said, I believe that the largest threat to us is climate change and it should be tackled first and foremost. If it isn't dealt with then none of this will matter.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2016, 04:31:18 PM by convex airplane »

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #51 on: November 13, 2016, 04:49:56 PM »
Blaming Islam is a waste of time. Nothing will come of it besides an "us versus them" mentality. The crux of the matter is immigrants are coming from poor, depressed areas with low standard of living. Even if they were atheist they would still be causing problems. It's the same reason why so many black people live in ghettos and contribute to crime per capita more than other races. Their ancestors used to be slaves, and therefore were the poorest and least educated of our society and since social mobility is in the gutter it continues to this day.

Don't get me wrong, their religious practices suck. But so do Christians who live in these areas.

Offline convex airplane

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #52 on: November 13, 2016, 05:13:06 PM »
Blaming Islam is a waste of time. Nothing will come of it besides an "us versus them" mentality. The crux of the matter is immigrants are coming from poor, depressed areas with low standard of living. Even if they were atheist they would still be causing problems. It's the same reason why so many black people live in ghettos and contribute to crime per capita more than other races. Their ancestors used to be slaves, and therefore were the poorest and least educated of our society and since social mobility is in the gutter it continues to this day.

Don't get me wrong, their religious practices suck. But so do Christians who live in these areas.

But we aren't talking about petty crimes like robberies and vandalism. We are talking about the systematic oppression of more than 50% (women, gays, other religions, etc.) of the population.
I'm not saying we should blame Islam for our troubles, I don't think any of the problems facing me are due to Islam. But I am saying we should recognise that it is a fucked up religion and defending it only supports the inhumane practices.

People are angry, they need someone to blame. Trump gave them a scapegoat = foreigners, Bernie gave them a scapegoat = the 1%, Clinton just said "love Trumps hate". What did she expect to happen? This was an election fuelled by fear and anger, the Dems chose the wrong candidate and message. They forgot the definition of the word "minority". You can't spend all your time fighting for the "minorities" and take the "majority" for granted. Moral arguments aside: it's just bad politics.

The Dems should ask themselves why they could not get Obama voters to vote for Clinton.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #53 on: November 13, 2016, 05:25:11 PM »
That's all situational too. In Uganda Christians are no better and it's also poor as dirt. Backwater places have backwater beliefs. Sure, they shouldn't get a free pass but it's ignoring the important issue.

I agree the Democrats put out a garbage candidate, I'm sure that's in no small part Clinton's fault.

Offline convex airplane

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #54 on: November 13, 2016, 05:37:30 PM »
but it's ignoring the important issue.

What's the important issue?

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #55 on: November 13, 2016, 05:43:11 PM »
but it's ignoring the important issue.

What's the important issue?

That these are poor areas in need to economic and social upheaval. Religion is a mere symptom and treating it is difficult and ineffective.

Even if  Islam was the problem, what would you want to be done?

Offline convex airplane

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #56 on: November 14, 2016, 02:53:13 AM »
but it's ignoring the important issue.

What's the important issue?

That these are poor areas in need to economic and social upheaval. Religion is a mere symptom and treating it is difficult and ineffective.

Even if  Islam was the problem, what would you want to be done?

Could not agree more, as far as problems go, it's far down the list. However, the Dems choice to not even address extremist Islam was and is foolish.

I agree with you that it is purely scaremongering and distracting people from the important issues, but I reckon the Democrats could have just jumped over this entire issue by saying "Yeah, it's shitty and we don't agree with it, but these refugees need help and we are willing to help." But instead they took the bait and called people deplorable and xenophobic.
For sure, let's get back to the important issues.


If Islam was the problem what would I do? Good & tough question. Really no good way of going about it. First thing I would address though would be an end to the pandering of standards such as allowing governmental employees to wear religious attire. Justin Trudeau types are the worst. He just appoints diversity to his neoliberal cabinet and then holds as many photo ops as possible.

Offline rdeyd1 573

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #57 on: November 14, 2016, 04:09:40 PM »
The brain trust for the dems are going to put an extreme Muslim as head of the DNC why don't they just go ahead and pull the trigger?

Islam is the problem and the only problem these people have when you have no free will to choose whether or not they want to belong or not has no place in the world today and if you can't see that then you are blind and a fool.


And I have to ask who are you Llama where are you from and don't say this here merica I ask because your post are witty and thought provoking but with a hint of darkness you must live on one of the coast and you have to be some kind of a government shill because all your points are straight huffington post and DNC I mean straight down the line it kept me up most of the night the other day thinking about you💋
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence;it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."  -George Washington

There are two kinds of fascist: fascist and anti-fascist

Offline Cheese

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #58 on: November 15, 2016, 08:39:37 AM »
I live in the rust belt. I don't support the DNC either. If I am a shill then I'm still waiting on my paycheck.

Offline Ucah8er

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Re: Decision 2016
« Reply #59 on: November 16, 2016, 06:32:03 AM »
I just can't believe the government of the nation that uses the most resources

But that's China.

I obviously don't live in US but I have to agree with rdeyd and alphapug here to a certain degree. The left controls all the media and can spin any dissenting candidate of the political correct into the second coming of Hitler. It has gotten pretty tiresome to see this happen every damn time, everywhere in the west. The common folk is tired of being shamed as being racist, homophobic, xenophobic, etc, all while actually being part of the most tolerant society in history EVER. I suggest you read up on the Shy Tory factor if you can't understand what I'm talking about. People are tired of being shamed in public for being conservative while it's actually widely accepted in private. Being conservatie is not synonymous with being a racist or homophobe or whatever! This political correct bullshit must end!
About the statement made "Fuck muslims". Obviously I don't fully agree with that seeing as I have some personal friends who are muslims. I do agree with the sentiment that muslims coming into the west who do not respect western values and/or are out to overthrow them should immediately be sent back. I'm a huge supporter of partial cultural integration and I believe the mass immigration of people with anti western beliefs prevented the usual gradual integration. We fucked up (see the refugee crisis and how germany 'handled' it). I'm not blaming muslims, I'm blaming policy makers who let many in unchecked or without any programs made for them ahead to prep them for integration.
The common folk I talked about earlier pay taxes to support this perhaps too open immigration system and this refugee crisis. Being critical about it or attempting to rationalize and/or tone down the proces more is suddenly racist or xenophobic or whatever? Yea right. This election is a big fuck you to the establishment who thought they could just keep getting away with it and I hope the domino blocks in Europe will fall too. Apologies if some of these sentences don't make sense, I typed it out on the bus real quick.

EDIT: for the record. My muslim friends are completely integrated. They are highly educated, speak perfect dutch, dress like any other belgian and were born here. They don't support any fundamental form of Islam and only practice it partially in private. They completely subscribe to western enlightened values otherwise (eg women rights). I am aware that they form a large minority in Belgium. I've seen some weird shit in Brussels you wouldn't believe.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2016, 06:37:55 AM by Ucah8er »